Venom vs Crona Q and A

General Questions on Crona

Can Crona affect Venom with soul and mind based attacks?”

The answer is probably yes. It is true that Symbiotes are immune to the Penance Stare used by the Ghost Riders.

• The Penance Stare backfires when used on Venom https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Ghost-Rider-Blaze-Spirits-of-Vengeance/Issue-6?id=72328#5

• Does not work on Carnage https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Symbiote-of-Vengeance/Full?id=160613#21

• Did not work on Venom again https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Thunderbolts-2013/Issue-23?id=8311#7

However this protection is not absolute, and was likely specific to the Penance Stare, as it never comes up in other similar situations. During an arc in Agent Venom, Flash (and later a girl wearing a clone of the Venom symbiote) get afflicted with something called a Hell Mark. This mark essentially corrupts their soul and eventually leads to the girl becoming more erratic.

• Hell Mark works on Flash https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2011/Issue-24?id=20913#7

• Works on another girl with clone of the symbiote https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-Space-Knight/Issue-10?id=78131#17 

Venom has also been knocked out by psychic attacks before and the symbiote does not protect against direct psychical attacks against the host (although the symbiote can still move the host body if it was not targeted). The symbiote has also been controlled via dark magic. Even relatively more normal people can repel or more easily control the symbiote, if they are trained in psychic defense.

• A host being mentally attacked https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Deadpool-Back-in-Black/Issue-5?id=97972#11
  https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Deadpool-Back-in-Black/Issue-5?id=97972#12

• Jean was confident she could effect venom https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/X-Men-Blue/Annual-1?id=129412#16 https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/X-Men-Blue/Annual-1?id=129412#17

• Jean easily connects to the Venom symbiote and knocks it out https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Extraordinary-X-Men/Issue-12?id=78154#8
  https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Extraordinary-X-Men/Issue-12?id=78154#9

• The symbiote being subdued with magical dark magic in War of the Realms. https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/War-of-the-Realms/Issue-4?id=155497#1 https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/War-of-the-Realms/Issue-4?id=155497#15  https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/War-of-the-Realms/Issue-5?id=156438#23 

• Lee Pryce being able to overturn influence of a symbiote due to psychic training https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2016/Issue-2?id=98701&readType=0#10 https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2016/Issue-2?id=98701&readType=0#11 

Additionally, Crona’s Mad Blood is effective on those with an anti-demon wavelength, which specifically protects them from soul manipulation associated with their “madness”. https://manganelo.com/chapter/read_soul_eater_manga/chapter_83

But if symbiotes are immune to the Penance Stare shouldn’t they be immune to soul/mental attacks?

Resisting the Penance Stare does not necessarily require resistance to soul or emotional manipulation. Many characters have survived it for various reasons.

• Some people are immune due to having no soul https://imgur.com/a/unKXad2 

• Johnny Blaze resisted it due to not regretting his actions https://imgur.com/a/M7XmBBX

• Thanos was immune due to having no regret for his actions https://imgur.com/a/7E8XsrP

• Captain Marvel didn’t regret her actions and was immune https://imgur.com/a/rD6oySZ 

• It being difficult to use on people with tons of eyes https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-d875c63b740d7531032b0c4e6c63a1a3.webp 

• https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/656321384678424605/760729324147048468/image0.jpg 

• It’s unable to be used on a blind person

As for why symbiotes resist it, it's never been outright explained. But I can give a few theories.

1. Symbiotes don’t actually have eyes in a traditional sense, so there’s nothing to lock onto. Or perhaps being able to see out of all their surfaces causes a problem with locking on.

2. Since the symbiote is being worn by someone else when the Penance Stare is used, the Stare malfunctions due to multiple targets 

3. Somehow the symbiote causes problems because it can hold memories of other organisms and hosts. Having all of this feedback into the Ghost Rider at once overloads them. 

4. The symbiotes originating from knull causes some kind of adverse reaction.

5. It’s just some specific quirk of their biology with no canon explanation.

Personally, I think option 3 is the most likely explanation. Symbiotes can take on memories from prior hosts. It’s something that’s come up multiple times in the series, and is why Eddie learned about Peter’s identity.  When the Penance Stare was used on Venom in Thunderbolts, memories of the host being used by multiple people were shown, including Spider-man and Eddie.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Thunderbolts-2013/Issue-23?id=8311#7 

Ghost Rider even says “So much sin. So many lives”. Referencing that he saw the lives of everyone who had been significantly connected to the symbiote at once. That probably either overloaded him, or the contradicting memories caused a malfunction and feedback loop.

But symbiotes have also resisted hellfire?

Dark Carnage was resistant to hellfire due to Cleatus’s prior exposure to the Dark Hold curse. Venom himself was still affected and harmed by it when he came across it.

• It being stated Dark Carnage was immune to hellfire because of the Dark Hold curses https://twitter.com/cullenbunn/status/1160542963354755072 

• Venom still feeling pain from hellfire https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Funeral-Pyre/Full?id=158590#23 

What about when Venom went to the realm of madness/insanity?

Venom gets sent to a place called the realm of madness. 

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-The-Madness/Issue-3?id=79317#2

This is a location where a person's thoughts and fears take on a tangible form.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/The-Official-Handbook-of-the-Marvel-Universe-Deluxe-Edition/Issue-12?id=115728&readType=0#67

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Doctor-Strange-1974/Issue-68?id=33913#17

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Doctor-Strange-1974/Issue-68?id=33913#18 

He apparently isn’t affected by the realm and gets out. So the argue is he has immunity to madness because of this. This kind of ignores how this realm works.

While there are some entities in the realm of madness that can affect a person's mental state, the realm and denizens create illusions and react based on the thoughts and fears of the person brought in. Naturally, if you’re somebody who is sane, you deal with your mind’s worst fears coming to life negatively, but somebody who is already insane isn’t going to react the same way to illusions crafted from their own mind.This is why it's stated that the more insane you are, the easier it is to negotiate and move around the realm of insanity. It’s less about resistance and more about not caring or being able to disregard products of your own mind.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-The-Madness/Issue-3?id=79317#14

It’s also worth pointing out that madness in Soul Eater can work on people who are already insane by driving them more insane. Not to mention there are multiple variations and levels of “Madness” in Soul Eater, that have varying effects. https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/656321384678424605/756964599793844365/image0.png?width=320&height=515 

Are you really sure the Venom symbiote is vulnerable to psychic or emotional manipulation?

Yes. The idea of a symbiote becoming mentally or spiritually “corrupt” is actually a pretty recurring theme in the comics. Essentially symbiotes feed off of and can influence the emotions of the host. If the host is evil or chemically imbalanced, it can lead to the symbiote becoming more aggressive, evil, mentally unstable or even feral. 

• Explanation that the symbiotes can be corrupted by the evil of chemically imbalaced individuals https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Guardians-of-the-Galaxy-2013/Issue-23?id=4772#17

• Eddie explaning how his rage feeds the symbiote https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2011/Issue-12?id=20886#6

• The symbiote mentioning it needed Eddie to stay in control https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2016/Issue-161?id=130333#21

• The symbiote enjoying feelings of anger https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2016/Issue-150?id=112962#32

• The symbiote mentioning various hosts corrupted its behaviour https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2016/Issue-3?id=101306#4

• Having been corrupted by bonding with Mucuro https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-Space-Knight/Issue-6?id=47680#19

• Going on a rampage after being corrupted https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-Space-Knight/Issue-8?id=61407#14

• The symbiote in a more feral state https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/The-Spectacular-Spider-Man-2003/Issue-1?id=19238#22

This is part of the reason why Eddie’s behavior was so odd early on in his career, and why some people who wear the symbiote often can’t control themselves. The symbiote has been “cleansed” of the corruption more than once, but has regressed several times as well. Symbiotes as a species are empathetically receptive, often psychically, something that was noted early on in the comics. 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Spider-Man-Super-Special/Full?id=89216#11 

The Venom symbiote's personality has altered largely over the years because of this. It makes no sense to think it would have some huge immunity to it. Particularly when there’s been antipsychotic drugs created to dampen their personalities.

• Anti symbiote serum https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2011/Issue-34?id=20935#14
  And https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2016/Issue-155?id=122749#11
  And https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2016/Issue-157?id=124801#9
  And https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-1?id=134179#5
  And https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-21?id=165498#13

Misc questions on Crona

Can Crona “infect” Venom with black blood?

Crona can contaminate foes with black blood in two seperate ways. They can infect the hosts with Black Blood or simply expose them to mad blood. Does Venom have any defenses between these two?

Yes and no. 

It isn’t feasible to permanently infect Eddie’s system with Black Blood the same way Maka was. There are many examples of the symbiote giving Eddie the ability to eliminate or purge foreign objects from his system.

• Purging poison from Eddie’s system
  https://i.imgur.com/oJlYTI6.jpg

• Vents poison gas
  https://imgur.com/a/JTMS7Qe

• Altering the chemicals in his blood https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-5?id=138713#8

• Fights off sedatives but it takes time https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2011/Issue-4?id=20948#9

• Resists paralyzing darts
  https://i.imgur.com/GbM7b9C.png

• Fights off poison
  https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2011/Issue-6?id=20960#6

• Removing substances from a brain https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-The-Hunger/Issue-4?id=80014#21

The Black Blood itself is even reminiscent of something called the Mercury Virus, a sentient virus which merged with Eddie and the symbiote, and temporarily made him more insane than usual. To be clear, this virus did affect Eddie’s personality, but he did have enough sense to expel it from his body at the end of said comic arc.

• Affected by the mercury virus, which made his emotions and feelings more erratic. He expells the virus from his body at the end of the arc https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-The-Madness/Issue-2?id=79316#8
  https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-The-Madness/Issue-2?id=79316#12
  http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/mercurialvirusvenom.htm
  https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-The-Madness/Issue-3?id=79317#22

That said even if Venom can remove black or mad blood from their system. Coming into contact with it, particularly mad blood, still carries the madness wavelength effect. Making the purge work around more of a mitigating factor.

Will Corona be affected by the symbiote's telepathy? 

Symbiotes do have some telepathic abilities and can project their emotions mentally. The Venom symbiote has done this once to literally make tons of other symbiotes kill themselves out of sadness. On one occasion, it does affect some humans to basically make them feel sad.

• Venom basically convinces a bunch of symbiotes that life sucks and they should kill themselves https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Spider-Man-Super-Special/Full?id=89216#11
  https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Spider-Man-Super-Special/Full?id=89216#15

• Flash does this with the Venom symbiote again https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2011/Issue-27?id=20919#18

• This psychic scream is shown to affect normal people as well https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Amazing-Spider-Man-Super-Special/Full?id=81091#23

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Amazing-Spider-Man-Super-Special/Full?id=81091#25

Would this affect Crona? No not really.

The impact is lesser on humans because they aren't as emotionally receptive as the symbiote species. It’s really only effective on the symbiotes because they’re highly receptive to emotional manipulation. Crona’s Black Blood madness and trauma already makes them pretty emotionally unstable by default. There’s not really anything the symbiote could make Crona “feel” that would put them at a disadvantage. Crona was also fine while in Asura’s presence, despite the fact he can also mentally manipulate anyone who comes near him with his madness wavelength

Can Crona melt or absorb Venom? 

Venom has resistance to acid and absorption. When the villain Dirtnap tried to absorb him, it could not break down the Venom symbiote. Flash was also unaffected by acid webbing from some spider-monsters. Finally when the symbiote was captured in a lab, it was immune to acid due to its inorganic makeup.

• Venom avoiding absorption because his symbiote is difficult to break down
  https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-vs-Wolverine-Tooth-and-Claw/Issue-1?id=79322#16
  https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-vs-Wolverine-Tooth-and-Claw/Issue-3?id=79324#9

• Wolverine avoiding absorbtion from the same character https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Wolverine-1988/Issue-95?id=10572#19

• Survives acid webbing
  https://imgur.com/a/YHZFhhv

• Said acid does not affect him https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2003/Issue-12?id=20519#5

This is relevant due to Crona’s Mad Blood, which can dissolve bodies and physical objects. Mad Blood is also how Crona essentially absorbs objects into themself. In other words it’s corrosive.

Now this is where real world science comes in and complicates things. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corrosive_substance

A “corrosive” substance is something that makes other substances break down via a chemical reaction. These chemical reactions are often not standardized. Different acids, bases, ect can break down different substances based on how their molecules interact. Generally, stronger acids and bases have an easier time breaking down substances than weaker ones. If something does not react at all to a corrosive agent, that means its chemically inert to said corrosive substance.

So the Venom symbiote is probably chemically inert towards most acids because it is inorganic, similar to silica in glass.

https://www.britannica.com/technology/glass

https://www.quora.com/Is-glass-made-from-carbon

https://www.reddit.com/r/askscience/comments/scwmg/why_doesnt_acid_eat_through_glass/

So the question mainly becomes whether Crona’s Black Blood affected anything inorganic and what kind of corrosive does it fall under? 

Well, the second part of that question can’t be answered. The first part can be kind of inferred.

https://manganelo.com/chapter/read_soul_eater_manga/chapter_87

Crona’s blood takes out an entire city and reverts the entire thing into a solid ball of black blood. This includes the buildings and everything in them,which probably includes the glass, an inorganic compound which is normally resistant or immune to most forms of acid. That said it’s ambiguous enough that for the sake of the episode we just assumed Venom would be “mostly” fine from the mad blood's melting effects.

How does Crona’s healing compare to Venom?

Venom

Venom’s healing factor is pretty advanced, albeit not as great as Carnage’s. The symbiote can heal him from gunshot wounds, impalement, having arms cut off, broken bones, deep cuts, restart his heart and alter his body chemistry as needed. It seems for some reason that body parts removed while Eddie isn’t wearing the symbiote can’t be recovered, but it can replace them with its own mass after the fact.

Being shot https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/The-Spectacular-Spider-Man-1976/Annual-12?id=19220#35

Being shot again https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-Separation-Anxiety/Issue-3?id=52914#5

Twisting the host’s neck https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2003/Issue-4?id=20577#8

Having an arm cut off https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2003/Issue-7?id=20548#13

Fixing a bullet  wound https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2016/Issue-3?id=101306#9

Being stabbed https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2016/Issue-156?id=123515#13

Healing a bullet wound https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2016/Issue-156?id=123515#19

Healing from impalation https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-1?id=134179#29

Repairing cells and starting eddies heart https://imgur.com/a/FvtgzL9

Slash wound https://i.imgur.com/ywbONKM.jpg

Sttab in the neck https://i.imgur.com/YNZnTzG.jpg

Stab in the chest https://imgur.com/a/nuaxPju

Impalement  https://imgur.com/a/vu2cHpz

Broken bones https://i.imgur.com/MWxmj29.jpg

Having his head blown in half https://imgur.com/a/UCyuIWV

Being punched through the mouth https://imgur.com/a/gJTrEjR

Deep cuts https://imgur.com/a/LyMpocH

Crona

So, Crona uses black blood to stem bleeding and heal themselves. They’ve been impaled for example, rip holes in their front or wrists when using black blood as a projectile. Ragnorok also technically explodes out of their front, back, sides, ect whenever it manifests itself. Crona also showed the ability to become a mass of black blood and then reform their body when absorbing the Kishin.

Impalement https://imgur.com/a/G9lBg

Reforming there body from black blood after absorbing the kishin https://s3.mkklcdnv3.com/mangakakalot/r1/read_soul_eater_manga/vol24_chapter_104_the_dark_side_of_the_moon_i/7.jpg

Ripping a hole out of there front the shoot a projectile of black blood https://s3.mkklcdnv3.com/mangakakalot/r1/read_soul_eater_manga/vol20_chapter_83_mad_blood/12.jpg

Creating various wounds from there body while using black blood for defense https://s3.mkklcdnv3.com/mangakakalot/r1/read_soul_eater_manga/vol6_chapter_19_fighting_to_death_part_4/47.jpg 

Summary

Crona probably has a slight edge here. On a base level both are pretty similar as they can recover from impalement and most general injuries, though Venom has more examples of recovering from brain damage or recovering limbs. Crona reforming their body is more impressive.

Does Crona have Asura’s abilities?

Yes. After absorbing Asura, Crona gained their abilities. They only lost control and had possession of their body reverted to Asura themself, because they happened to lose their mental fortitude for a short moment. Their souls also stayed fused at the end of the series. Crona specifically mentions wanting to use Asura’s madness to destroy the world.

• https://manganelo.com/chapter/read_soul_eater_manga/chapter_104 

Is Crona immortal or have Ashura’s regen?

Technically yes. The kishin was immortal and their immortality was connected to humanities fear. Crona would have that due to being fused with Asura. https://s61.mkklcdnv61.com/mangakakalot/r1/read_soul_eater_manga/vol25_chapter_112_the_dark_side_of_the_moon_ix/26.jpg 

You see this particularly with the “clowns” which are spawned via asura’s power, and resurrect endlessly 

https://s1.mangabeast01.com/manga/Soul-Eater/0095-024.png 

The anime also kind of supports the kishin having this kind of regen

https://youtu.be/b_Cop8XtOIM?t=405 

Crona also became a kishin themselves, and should likewise have similar immortality. Another person had a pretty decent break down of this here... https://docs.google.com/document/d/18lZ9Jhq80PzJ1BghXGdhscrMZuHQPK-6Q5scKrzzDHk/edit#heading=h.aup3b3c559la 

Anyway that’s probably enough to make it more or less impossible to put Crona down. I’ve heard arguments that the regen needs genetic material to be present to work based on how the clowns visually seem to be restored, or because Maka destroyed Asura with her courage punch in the anime, but I don’t think it would matter.  Given Crona can produce billions of gallons of black blood and spread it across city wide landscapes with no issue, there’s no reason to think Venom would be able to search out and destroy every speck of blood with his limited AOE. Not that he should know to do this anyway.

Though personally, Crona chooses to seal Asura away in the manga, because they knew outright he couldn’t be put down with physical force, due to fusing with him. The anime ending makes no sense, and isn’t congruent to how that aspect of the Kishin is established to work in the main canon anyway. 

Also worth noting that Asura does have a madness wavelength that can compel people to kill themselves, which is a tactic we know has worked on symbiotes in the past. Asura can end the fight that way, hence why the episode has a tab mentioning Asura would probably overcome any powers we could extrapolate for Venom.

General Venom questions

What about Venom’s Venomous bite?

Venom apparently has a venomous bite. This destabilised sandman.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Peter-Parker-Spider-Man/Issue-16?id=30216#17

Now being frank what exactly happened here is pretty ambiguous. It's mentioned in a few guides, but this ability has never come up sincehttps://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/656321384678424605/760669243569864735/unknown.png  

https://images-ext-2.discordapp.net/external/jd3AnVnp8P4icmiOLDDaLxrHUShdL-fyZ-q4sZqW7DU/https/media.discordapp.net/attachments/249320664652185600/760672115506151454/Screenshot_2020-09-29_at_9.14.34_PM.png 

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/656321384678424605/760674113173585950/image0.jpg 

My theory: The green goop you see from Venom’s mouth is actually the “excrement” from the symbiote. That excrement is probably what poisoned Sandman. That said, it’s pretty unlikely Venom could pierce Crona’s skin with a bite, given that their blood would just harden on contact. 

• Mention that the symbiote disolves substances in Eddie’s body  https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-7?id=141254#14

Crona’s black blood also eventually evolved into overcoming anti-demon wavelengths, which in universe could be used to destabilize it. That could probably be seen as resistance against Venom destabilizing their control in any way.

https://manganelo.com/chapter/read_soul_eater_manga/chapter_83

Can Venom possess Crona?

I think there seems to be some confusion regarding how a symbiote's possession actually works. It’s not like a magical ability where even the slightest touch from the Venom symbiote will put them under your control, there’s a biological process involved. What the symbiote actually does is merge to a person’s nervous system, particularly the central nervous system. From that interface it can mess with their body and or mind.

• The symbiote altered Eddie’s memories and body chemisty to simulate cancer https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-11?id=150248#17 https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-11?id=150248#19

• Attaches directly to the brain stem to overide a character’s telepathic control over a dino https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2016/Issue-153?id=118798#14

• Taking over various soldiers https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2011/Issue-30?id=20927#6

• Mentions he can weave into the parital lobe https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2016/Issue-2?id=98701#9

• Penetrating the midbrain https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2016/Issue-154?id=121904#7

• Can fuse with the nervous system https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2016/Issue-165?id=133636#4

• It has been revealed that the symbiote altered Eddie’s memories https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-11?id=150248#18

• Mind melding https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-Along-Came-a-Spider/Issue-1?id=52892#8

Now, in universe you can just straight up resist a symbiotes influence when it melds with your mind, if you have enough mental fortitude. You can also blow it off you with the right power set. There’s a lot of examples of people doing this, ranging from Flash, to Green Goblin to Captain Marvel and so on.

• Flash controlling the symbiote https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Scarlet-Spider-2012/Issue-10?id=24887#10

• Goblin tearing off the Carnage symbiote https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/The-Amazing-Spider-Man-1963/Issue-800?id=134948#57

• The Venom symbiote couldn’t take over Hulk until it let him https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Immortal-Hulk-and-Other-Tales/TPB?id=166357#33

• Captain Marvel fought off the influence of the Grendel symbiote and blew it off her with her powers https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Captain-Marvel/Full?id=164050#22

• Miles resisted and blew off a Grendel symbiote with his powers https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Miles-Morales/Issue-3?id=161848#5

• Doc Oct resisting, with Peter’s help as mind https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Superior-Spider-Man/Issue-25?id=3320#24

• Peter is also relatively unaffected by wearing a symbiote https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venomized/Issue-1?id=132793#13

Knowing this, even if the symbiote can take control of Crona’s nervous system, Ragnorok can still control and amplify the body's movements through the control of the Black Blood in their system. It can’t really gain full control over their body given that, and given most of Crona’s strength comes from Ragnorok’s manipulation of their blood in the first place, it’s likely that they would overpower control over Crona if it came down to it.

http://www.mangareader.net/soul-eater/18/9

The symbiote would have to either destroy the black blood in Crona’s system or remove it to actually win the fight this way. While destroying the blood cells or purging it for a normal person is probably pretty plausible, it would likely be way more difficult to do this to Crona just given how much more resilient Black Blood is, along with how quickly it can replicate. Plus it’s actually been revealed that Ragnorok can remove unwanted objects from their system as Crona did so when they accidentally absorbed a normal human along with the kishin.

https://www.mangareader.net/soul-eater/104/6

https://www.mangareader.net/soul-eater/104/7 

I would also say the Kishin's mental influence on people is greater than the symbiotes. He uniformly can drive the entire planet into madness with his effects on their mind. Crona was able to be around them and was in control of their fusion for a while. This puts doubt on the idea that the symbiote alone could control them mentally.

But Carnage took over an entire town at once via possession?

He didn’t do that spontaneously. He consumed a ton of biomass to grow the symbiote so it could stretch that far. Venom’s also never done this before.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Carnage-U-S-A/Issue-1?id=44940#4 

Questions about the Klyntar hive mind

What is the Klyntar hive mind?  

The Kyntar race has the ability to create “hive minds” that others in their race can connect to for the sake of communication or a power boost. There are actually several Klyntar hive minds in Marvel comics. 

During Flash Thompson’s run as Venom he goes to the Kyntar home world, where it’s explained they have a hive mind of symbiotes. Some symbiotes, such as the Venom symbiote disconnected from this hive due to mental corruption. 

Then it was explained in 2018 that a large part of the hive mind Flash came into contact with was also connected to the primordial god Knull. It’s not explained what exactly the difference between the two is, but Knull’s inclusion in the hive mind was apparently kept a secret, so it's probably that part of the hive is its own separate thing not everyone has access to. In the recent Venom 2018 arc, Venom also connects to a hive mind found in universe 1610. 

Anyway, symbiotes do get boosts from hive minds. Though they aren't uniform boosts in power and some powers seem unique to specific hives. Most of them will grant the user new powers, or access to collective information. The people connecting to the hive may have varying stats.

Pre-Knull hive mind

It is being stated that there were many symbiotes who broke off from the pre-knull hive at times due to corruption 

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Guardians-of-the-Galaxy-2013/Issue-23?id=4772#17 

Flash coming across the Kyntar hive mind on its homeworld https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Guardians-of-the-Galaxy-2013/Issue-23?id=4772#16

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Guardians-of-the-Galaxy-2013/Issue-23?id=4772#17 

A flashback of Venom back when he got his first host. A member of the Kree. Before this he was a member of the pre-Knull hive.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-Space-Knight/Issue-12?id=89457#4 

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-Space-Knight/Issue-12?id=89457#5 

Flash connected the Venom symbiote to the pre-Knull hive mind. This increased his symbiotes power and let him hear “the voice of the cosmos”. Though he was still shown to be fightable by Spider-man when he returned to earth

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Guardians-of-the-Galaxy-2013/Issue-23?id=4772#18 

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-Space-Knight/Issue-11?id=84819#17 

The “agents of the cosmos” are connected to the pre-Knull hive. https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-Space-Knight/Issue-7?id=51798#16      

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-Space-Knight/Issue-10?id=78131#4 

Knull hive mind (includes the pre-knull hive mind)

Hive mind stated to be upheld by Knull

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-4?id=137663#18 

The Klyntar keeping Knull imprisoned were also part of the hive mind

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-Of-Venom-Wraith/Issue-1?id=175514#16 

The symbiote soldiers such as Rex had a connection to the Knull hive. They were beaten by Wolverine, Nick fury Sr and some soldiers.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-6?id=139853#5 

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Ve-Nam/Full?id=139045#29 

Brock's son Dylan connected to the symbiote hive mind. This allowed him to survey events from other symbiotes, but did not otherwise increase physical stats.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-24?id=168639#15 

Alternate universe hive mind

Venom mentioning that the alternate universe has a hive mind on it

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-27?id=174521#8

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-27?id=174521#12 

It should be noted having the ability to connect with a hive mind, doesn’t always mean a character is constantly doing it. When Venom traveled to universe 1610 the symbiote had to search out for the hive in that universe first.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-27?id=174521#8 

How does the mind hive relate to Venom?

Venom gets reconnected to the Knull hive mind again during the 2018 run of Venom and he unlocks some powers from that. Seemingly different ones than those he had as space knight Venom.

 A short timeline of events as follows.

Eddie fights the Grendel symbiote dragon. During the fight, Miles Morales uses a massive Venom blast to destabilize the monster, since apparently symbiotes are weak against it.

 https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-3?id=136195#13 

After that happens, Knull creates an avatar of himself through Grendel's body mass. Venom's mind is affected by Knull’s presence and he gets curb stomped. Miles takes the Knull off guard again with a Venom Blast, which prevents him from doing too much damage.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-3?id=136195#19

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-4?id=137663#20 

During the confrontation the Venom symbiote very briefly reconnects with Knull’s hive mind. To be clear, it did not fully connect, nor did it retain a full connection to the hive mind at this time. But having that connection for even a second gave the Venom symbiote new abilities. Such as the ability to fly.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-5?id=138713#9 

Eddie later fights the Grendel symbiote dragon again, but realizes he can’t win on his own. The grendel symbiote had been hunting down pieces of itself that had been detached years ago to get more power. Venom comes across one of these pieces known as the character Rex, who was originally part of this grendel symbiote. Rex doesn’t want to rejoin the Grendle and agrees to merge with Venom to give him back up during the fight. Rex is the one who uses a connection to the hive mind to call the dragon.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-5?id=138713#18 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-6?id=139853#5 

Eddie later gets a full connection to Knull’s hive mind after he uses the legion symbiote to kill Dark Carnage, and absorbs his codices. From that point on, his symbiote can seemingly reconnect to other symbiote hive minds whenever it wants.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-27?id=174521#8

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-27?id=174521#12 

The fact Flash is technically connected to a hive mind during his run, only for it to be brought up recently is slightly contradictory. It’s likely that it’s just due to the fact that Flash’s symbiote didn’t have the ability to communicate back to the hive on its own at the time or something of that nature.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Guardians-of-the-Galaxy-2013/Issue-23?id=4772#18 

Questions about codex’s

What are codex’s?

Codex’s are bits of symbiote pieces wrapped around the DNA of people and contain a remnant of the connection to Knull’s hive mind. If a symbiote has been cut off from the hive, collecting enough codex restores a symbiote’s ability to communicate to said hive mind.

• Eddie explaining the codex concept https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Director-s-Cut-Part-1?id=159080#5

• It being stated codex’s are used to send information https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Carnage-Born/Full?id=144336#21 

• The maker saying codex’s are used as communication to the hive https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-8?id=143875#8 

Codex’s are normally concentrated mostly in the spine, hence Canarge typically killed his opponents to get at them 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Symbiote-of-Vengeance/Full?id=160613#17

It’s a plot point in recent comics that collecting enough codexes, could repair a symbiote’s link to Knull’s hivemind, wake him up and make him come to earth. 

• The maker saying the Venom symbiote can reconnect to the hive with codices https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-8?id=143875#9 

• Carnage having the connection to Knull’s hive mind via codices being explained https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Carnage-Born/Full?id=144336#30 

• Eddie explaining how Carnage was going to reconnect to the hive https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Free-Comic-Book-Day-2019/Spider-Man-Venom?id=155272#2 

What kind of boosts do codex’s give you

They probably give 3

1.First off is an increased connection or restored ability for a symbiote to link to hive minds on their own. As stated further above, this can grant added abilities.

2. Absorbing symbiote matter generally makes a symbiote stronger. This has happened in other comics where symbiotes have merged with entire other symbiotes. Miles morales alludes to this when he calls codex’s a piece of power.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Issue-4?id=162362#12 

3. They allow you to temporarily channel the personality and powers of whoever the codice was from.

• Dark Carnage for example, absorbed a codice from the character Alejandra. https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Symbiote-of-Vengeance/Full?id=160613#18 

Because the Spirit of Vengeance was in the character Red Hulk when they bonded to the Venom symbiote, the Spirit of Vengeance itself had a codice. Alejandra then inherited that codice when she utilized the Spirit of Vengeance..  https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Symbiote-of-Vengeance/Full?id=160613#19 

Absorbing this codice gave Carnage Ghost Rider-like powers, however these powers started to fade by the end of the issue. (Note: Again, the codice originally belonged to the Spirit of Vengeance itself, not Alejandra) https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Symbiote-of-Vengeance/Full?id=160613#31 

• This instance with Dark Carnage was also not the only time this happened. Earlier in Venom 2018 Eddie absorbed a codice from Flash Thompson. Flash’s entire mental imprint is in the codice and Flash himself actually took over control of Eddie’s body for a short period of time. At the end of the comic, this mental imprint burns out, which Eddie states himself.https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-8?id=143875#19

What is the legion symbiote? Should Venom have it?

During the Absolute Carnage arc in the Venom series, the Venom symbiote is absorbed by the Grendel/Carnage symbiote. In an effort to fight back, Eddie merges with a bunch of standalone codices and his own latent codices, to create a new symbiote called the Legion symbiote. This symbiote has mental imprints of Captain America and Wolverine. As well as the eyesight of Hawkeye and the physical power of The Thing.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Issue-4?id=162362#20 

The legion symbiote is what Eddie uses to defeat Dark Carnage (not the normal Venom symbiote). The legion symbiote then merged with the Grendel and original Venom symbiote. 

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Issue-5?id=163875#18 

While the Grendle symbiote is eventually expunged during the Venom Island arch, presumably the Venom symbiote retained the codices that were in the Legion symbiote.

Anyway, since codex based powers and mental imprints are not permanent Eddie does not have those powers anymore. His ability to connect with the symbiote hives was apparently restored and as of now permanent, but any other boost the codices gave Dark Carnage was also lost. As it was stated, those codices got destroyed when the two symbiotes merged.

Questions on Grendle and Dark carnage

Can you explain the grendel symbiote

The Grendle symbiote 

In the recent Venom run, it’s revealed that the Kyntar race was created by a dark god named Knull. Knull essentially can mold the symbiotes into weapons, and one of those is a series of giant dragons. He controls these dragons via a hive mind and during one of the conquests a dragons got struck down by Thor.  

The original Grendle being struck down https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-1?id=134179#3

And https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-4?id=137663#14

The Grendle is later recovered by the government, who try to use it to make super soldiers. Eddie, Miles and a few others then fight it at a later date, defeating via sound, fire, venom blasts, ect.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Ve-Nam/Full?id=139045#7

The Grendle symbiote is not a normal symbiote. It’s much much more powerful than an average symbiote even with small fragments, and this has been stated multiple times. It can also grow stronger by consuming other symbiotes. It has several powers most normal symbiotes don't, such as resurrecting corpses for example, and controlling.people with offshoots of itself. https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-2?id=135623#16 

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-5?id=138713#13

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-2?id=135623#19 

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-4?id=137663#19 

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-4?id=137663#12 

Dark Carnage

Some time later, a fragment of the Grendle is recovered by a cult. 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Carnage-Born/Full?id=144336#20 

They use this fragment to resurrect Cletus, the former Carnage. Cleatus, along with his original symbiote had actually died beforehand.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Carnage-Born/Full?id=144336#25

• https://twitter.com/Doncates/status/1126269751620243463

This resurrected Carnage absorbs a “codex” left by the Carnage symbiote in the character Scorn. seemingly imprinting the Carnage symbiote’s personality onto the Grendel symbiote. He then consumes 100s of codex’s from the town he took over in Carnage USA. Since all the codex’s were from Carnage, the Grenade becomes permanently ‘carnaginlized’.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Carnage-Born/Full?id=144336#26

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Carnage-Born/Full?id=144336#29

Taking codexes from a town 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Cult-of-Carnage/Full?id=153535#31

Carnage then decides he wants to gather codexes to gain more power and reconnect to the hive mind to wake up the symbiote god Knull. He ends up becoming a herald level threat more or less.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Carnage-Born/Full?id=144336#30

Can you explain the Grendle symbiotes power progression

Dark Carnage and the Grendle’s power wasn’t static. They underwent several transformations and changes. On a basic level, the Grendel is stronger than most normal symbiotes, even without a host or with small fragments.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-2?id=135623#16 

Grendle dragon

• The original form of the Grendle was a giant dragon used for world conquest https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-3?id=136195#11 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-5?id=138713#13

It eventually comes across Thor who one shots it with a lightning bolt. This is what overwhelms Knull and disconnects him from his hive. Knull mentions Thor was stronger than any opponent he had met 

•  https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-4?id=137663#14 

Thor also beat Grendel's mother and other dragons just as easily. To be fair, some people claim this is due to the electricity, but losing the fights in single strikes should prove they’re not comparable anyway.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Scream-Curse-of-Carnage/Issue-3?id=166781#4 

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Scream-Curse-of-Carnage/Issue-5?id=169412#5 

Between the time Eddie comes across it, it gets frozen,and several of its pieces are taken

•  https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-1?id=134179#27

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-2?id=135623#11

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-4?id=137663#19 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-5?id=138713#15 

During the course of the story, Miles Morales blows up the Grendle symbiote’s body mass when they first come across it with a giant Venom Blast 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-3?id=136195#13

• Later, Venom fuses with the symbiote Rex and goes after the Dragon again. He blows apart its body with sound grenades and anti sybimiote weapons https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-6?id=139853#9 

Knulls avatars

Knull could also manifest avatars using the Grendle symbiote’s body mass.

Eddie gets easily beaten the first time, with Knull just blasting the symbiote off him.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-3?id=136195#19 

The second time, Venom merges with another symbiote called Rex, but still nearly loses when Knull tries to absorb both symbiotes. Eddie ends up having to set off a ton of sonic grenades his symbiotes had been carrying in their mass. 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-6?id=139853#12 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-6?id=139853#15

The sound explosion took Knull off guard and with the Grendle dragon temporarily paralyzed, what’s left of rex pulls the remaining Grendel into the furnace

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-6?id=139853#18

Symbiote soldiers

Another form of the Grendle was a series of symbiote soldiers. These were created by bonding fragments of the Grendle symbiote that were used to create super soldiers. 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Ve-Nam/Full?id=139045#9 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Weapon-Plus/Full?id=163361#12 

Wolverine, Nick Fury Sr and some other soldiers eventually fight and subdue them after Knull’s influence on the symbiotes' minds drives them insane 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Ve-Nam/Full?id=139045#17

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Ve-Nam/Full?id=139045#21 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Ve-Nam/Full?id=139045#24 

The Grendle dragon or it’s fragments were not that problematic. The sym soldiers could be taken down by street level characters despite technically having a connection to Knull’s hive mind (Rex mentions having this and the sym soldiers went insane because of this connection). The original dragon was one shotted by Thor with no effort, and Miles Morales could also blow its body apart with a Venom Blast. Which is consistent with Eddie using things like Sonic grenades to blow it apart again later. The only thing you can kind of give is the fearless avatars, but they pretty easily overpowered Eddie both times anyway. Eddie just took him off guard the second time.

How about Dark Carnage’s power?

Dark Carnage is stronger than the original symbiote dragon. Though there’s a few factors that play into why.

1.Having an actual host naturally increases power

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-4?id=137663#11 

2. Dark Carnage inherited the Dark Hold immunity, getting rid of the exploitable weaknesses the original dragon had.

3. He collected a ton of codices, which added to his power and improved his hive connection

4. The grendel symbiote was already stronger than most symbiotes, and also had a direct mental link to Knull himself rather than just the mind hive as a whole.

• It being stated the grendle is linked to knull https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-23?id=167522#7 

• Grendle being stated to be part of the mind hive https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Weapon-Plus/Full?id=163361#11

• It being said Cleatus had contact with Knull https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Weapon-Plus/Full?id=163361#12 

• Carnage is stated to be empowered by Knull https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Avengers/Full?id=162375#2 

The thing with Dark Carnage in the Absolute Carnage storyline is that he actually has multiple different forms throughout the arc. The first one looks like classic Carnage, then he gets a sigil on his head, then he gets an emblem, then he merges with the Venom symbiote.

So 4 total

Normal

Carnage originally starts with a small fragment of the Grendel. In this form, he looks similar to his classic self. Going off the sym soldiers who were also created with small fragments of the Grendel, he probably shouldn’t have been “too” powerful at that time. 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Scream/Issue-3?id=162338#18 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Scream/Issue-3?id=162338#11

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Carnage-Born/Full?id=144336#30 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Cult-of-Carnage/Full?id=153535#31 

Sigil

After taking over a thousand codices from the town in Carnage USA, along with a few other places, he eventually develops a sigil.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Funeral-Pyre/Full?id=158590#18 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Weapon-Plus/Full?id=163361#12 

His best feat is fighting Weapon H. Who’s probably a mid-leveler 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Weapon-Plus/Full?id=163361#23 

Sigil and Emblem

Later near the height of his power, Carnage gets god like strength

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Free-Comic-Book-Day-2019/Spider-Man-Venom?id=155272#9

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Symbiote-Spider-Man/Full?id=160397#32 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Captain-Marvel/Full?id=164050#17

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Lethal-Protectors/Issue-1?id=160061#16 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Weapon-Plus/Full?id=163361#4 

His most impressive feat here is fighting the Ghost Riders.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Symbiote-of-Vengeance/Full?id=160613#5 

As well as taking hits from and knocking out the Hulk (albeit by altering his brain chemicals) 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Issue-4?id=162362#8 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Issue-4?id=162362#13 

Note in the case of the Hulk, the “Immortal” Hulk did not participate. 

• https://2.bp.blogspot.com/gdMkEc79xVamOpqHBFJRi0nNqgX5T5NQgr4sijEfRZQVvdGsji0FVXHn_KRp6QWYpSK7ydrLs4vLzGWlmxsTVH8P0J45_5HyF6gldP5XBHEspTe84cWcWSd1cryQr2kBS0_EZ1xdag=s1600 

This is consistent with writer statements that Canages’s power is around that of Hulks(around 42 mins) 

• http://stegmanandfriends.podbean.com/e/abscarn-boiz-wdonny-cates-absolute-carnage-1-chapter-one-directors-commentary/ 

Venom Absorbed

• Carnage absorbs the Venom symbiote. https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Issue-4?id=162362#14 

The form was at least on par with The Thing, Cap and Wolverine

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Issue-4?id=162362#16 

Didn’t Dark Carnage steal power from the Hulk when he took the Venom symbiote from it?

Nothing suggests this happened. There's a panel where Miles refers to how Hulk was currently wearing the Venom symbiote and that Carnage taking/merging with it would be a problem. He just meant that codex’s are just small fragments of symbiote, so taking a whole symbiote is a better boost.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Issue-4?id=162362#12 

The ability for symbiotes to merge is a recurring concept in the series.

• The symbiote hybrid was the result of multiple symbiotes combining together

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-Along-Came-a-Spider/Issue-1?id=52892#35

• Carnage attempted to merge with the Venom symbiote once

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/The-Amazing-Spider-Man-1963/Issue-363?id=4599#15 

• Carnage absorbed tons of symbiotes off the backs of human hosts once

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Spider-Man-Super-Special/Full?id=89216#6

Codex’s are concentrated mostly in the spine, which is why Carnage ripped them out and why they needed a specific machine to safely remove them. Carnage wouldn’t have gotten Hulk's powers that way because he never ripped out or ate his spin.

And no, a symbiote can’t just normally uptake a person's abilities like it did with Spider-Man after a few minutes of being worn. It takes 48 hours for a symbiote to fully bond to a host, a fact that was brought up multiple times in Flash’s run.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2011/Issue-1?id=20881#11 

The idea of this happening would also be pretty contradictory, as many people over the years have worn the Venom symbiote and this has not been shown to happen from such short usage. It happened with Spider-man because he was consistently wearing and using it.

https://www.ranker.com/list/every-character-to-wear-the-venom-symbiote/stephanroget 

Questions on Venom vs Dark Carnage

How many codex’s did Carnage and Venom have respectively?

Codices give temporary powers, give a stronger connection to the hive and probably a small power boost. Who had more between Carnage and Venom?

Carnage

• Carnage got about 1,145 from doverton

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Cult-of-Carnage/Full?id=153535#4 

• Makes it a point to indoctrinate people to hunt down more

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Unleashed/Issue-1?id=148011#30

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Unleashed/Issue-1?id=148011#31

• Gets another one here https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-vs-Deadpool/Issue-2?id=160584#7 

• Attemps to take deadpool’s here https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-vs-Deadpool/Issue-3?id=162339#17

• Another one here https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Weapon-Plus/Full?id=163361#3

• I see at least 8 here https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Weapon-Plus/Full?id=163361#12 

• Another here https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage-Lethal-Protectors/Issue-1?id=160061#16 

• Apparently got Norman and Gargan https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Issue-4?id=162362#12 

• Another here https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-of-Venom-Carnage-Born/Full?id=144336#28

So carnage had probably over 1,200-ish being conservative. Keep in mind, he hunted down a ton of people outside the ones we directly see.

Venom

The character the Maker constructs a machine that can be used to safely extract symbiote pieces. He takes them out of some of Venom’s allies so Carnage won't hunt them.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Issue-1?id=159079#35

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Issue-3?id=161051#11

Eddie merges those codices into the Legion symbiote, so he got codices of Wolverine, his son, The Thing, Captain America, Hawkeye, and his own (probably Venom and Toxin)

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Issue-4?id=162362#20 

So Venom had about 7 codices. Maybe slightly more if you take some of the comics opening narrations that imply dozens.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Issue-5?id=163875#2 

So in terms of powers from the codices, Carnage has like 100-170x more give or take.

Can Venom Beat Dark Carnage in a fair fight.

Eddie tried to fight Dark Carnage when he was in his emblem form, using the normal Venom symbiote (with the partial boost from Knull’s hive mind) and got knocked out in a single punch https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Issue-1?id=159079#17 

Eddie probably only put up a fight against Dark Carnage after it had absorbed the Venom symbiote because he was explicitly channeling powers of the Thing, Cap, Wolverine, ECT with the codices in the Legion symbiote at that time. Yes, it's true Carnage defeated all 3 of them together in an earlier issue, but Eddie  probably performed better than they did because he had all their powers, skill and personalities in one package. Any other explanation doesn’t make sense.

If it was just the codices and the hive mind connection, Dark carnage should have had the edge by a massive amount, given he had upwards of 1200 compared to Venom only having 7- a dozen. Though honestly, Carnage let Venom kill him and absorb the Grendel symbiote anyway, telling Eddie outright to do it so Knull would be awakened.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Issue-5?id=163875#17 

Venom fought Dark Carnage on Venom Island. Doesn’t that make them equal?

He was weaker on Venom Island than when he fought the Hulk, Ghost Rider, Captain Marvel or anyone else notable. Note the lack of sigel and emblem, as well as any link to Knull for power (which were present during all of these confrontations). Carnage was not in his “base” form when he fought any of those people.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-24?id=168639#19 

It was also stated his codices were destroyed when he merged with the Venom symbiote, so any boost Carnage got from the codices at all was gone. The fact Carnage lost his prior forms supports this.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-25?id=171479#13 

And despite having a full link to the hive mind at the time, the Venom symbiote still lost the fight. Being fair, it didn’t have a host, but the character Dylan was clearly amping it somewhat. This shows pretty clearly that he would not have won in the prior confrontation, and that connections to the hive mind don’t make all symbiotes equal in power.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-25?id=171479#24 

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Absolute-Carnage/Issue-5?id=163875#14 

Misc questions

What about Juggernaut?

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-28?id=175885#15

Eddie says that a fight with the “real” juggernaut would be a fair fight for him. It's made clear that the juggs he’s currently fighting are weaker than the real thing. Firstly, this comic just came out, so we can’t account for it. Secondly it's honestly just taking his word for it. From how Venom’s speaking, he’s probably just referring to how he’s had “fair” fights with Juggs in the past.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-The-Madness/Issue-2?id=79316#23 

How strong is Virus>

Virus is Mac Gargan (Scorpion) in a suite of armor called the Virus Armor. This armor has only shown up 3 times and has no visible feats of its own yet. There really isn’t any way to gauge his power outside extrapolation based on the technicality that his armor incorporates components of a war machine suite(which has had feats on that level).

But even then, a lot of his weaponry is clearly cobbled together from run down or discarded pieces of tech from multiple sources. The full composition of the armor is not Tony Stark technology, and Mac has no affiliation with him. The fact his suite is weaker , held together with duct tape and cheaply made is called out in the comic itself several times. 

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-26?id=173470#18 

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Venom-2018/Issue-28?id=175885#5

I can buy if being stronger than the average street leveler, but in isolation, if the Virus armor appeared in any other comic, I don’t think anyone would push it as being equal to War Machine, or even older Stark armors. It’s unlikely he has the defensive shield, fire power and combative skill of the actual Iron Man and War Machine suits.

 

But Venom has had potential legion stuff for 2 years and the Knull story is ending soon

The legion stuff was in Absolute Carnage #5 on Nov 20, 2019, and was likely situational. Even then, that’s only been about 10 or 11 months. And even then, only about 6 month’s worth of comics have come out in that time period due to internal delays caused by the covid pandemic. 

I know a lot of people compare this to Wally becoming unmoored, but this is not the same situation. Wally’s feats were due to him pushing his own limits, and the nature of his series had had crazy feats like that for decades. This upgrade people push for is much larger, and the storyline isn’t even over yet. Knull could be defeated and no one will be able to tap into his hive mind again. An outside God might intervene to help stop Knull.

• https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Web-Of-Venom-Wraith/Issue-1?id=175514#29 

He isn’t a Spider-Man character anymore.

I mean this is subjective.

Venom’s not a Spider-man character in the same way Nightwing isn’t a Batman character, or Spider-Gwen isn’t a “Spider-man” character. Yes they have stand alone stories because they have stand alone comics, but the symbiotes are still a large part of Spider-man lore as a whole. Spider-Gwen has a symbiote right now. The Carnage symbiote was the focus of a major storyline called Red Goblin in 2018. Agent Venom was a semi recurring ally.