Title: DEATH BATTLE Predictions: Green Arrow VS. Hawkeye
Teaser Text: The Emerald Archer VS. The Purple Avenger
TLDR: Thumbnail Art credited to Tedkeys.
Thumbnail Image: http://schmoesknow.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/hawkeye_green_arrow_by_tedkeys.jpg
Backstories
In case you were wondering...
Since Golden Age Green Arrow’s backstory is completely different from his Silver Age and Post Crisis backstories, we’re not going to mention it. While Post-Crisis Oliver’s backstory changed a bit, his personality and abilities are still fairly in-line with his Silver Age counterpart, so we’re assuming feats from both ages valid. The majority of his backstory is coming from Post-Crisis though.
Green Arrow
http://i.imgur.com/c8Z4qp8.jpg
Height: 5’11
Weight: 195 lbs
Oliver Jonas ‘Ollie’ Queen was born with a natural talent for archery, as well as owner of Queen Industries and a wealthy playboy (that sounds familiar). Be it through coincidence, his own drunken indulgence, or the betrayal of his friend Hackett (it varies from continuity) he wound up on Starfish Island, and was forced to adapt to survive using a makeshift bow and arrow. Eventually, he learned he wasn’t alone on the island, and put an end to a drug operation headed by China White using only said makeshift bow and a couple of improvised trick arrows.
He left the island a changed man with a newly discovered passion for crime fighting, and decided to take up the Robin Hood inspired guise of Green Arrow to fight crime. During that time, he gained his sidekick Speedy, got the hots for Black Canary (musical number sadly not included), and joined up with the Justice League. Personality-wise, the guy is pretty fun-loving, possessing much of the carefree attitude he did in his days of debauchery, though he gets serious when necessary.
Hawkeye
http://i.imgur.com/QA3Mzvh.png
Height: 6’3
Weight: 230 lbs
Clinton Francis ‘Clint’ Barton grew up in the mid-western state of Iowa to an abusive asshole of a father. With the help of his brother, Barney, Clint learned to improve his fighting and aiming skills. Fortunately for them, his dad died in a car accident while drunk. Unfortunately for them, after going through several foster homes they wound up with an equally abusive father. Clint and Barney subsequently ran away, eventually coming across and joining a travelling circus.
It was here that Clint gained his training from The Swordsman and Trickshot, taking up the name, Hawkeye. After learning his teachers had been swiping money from the circus a rift between Hawkeye and The Swordsman and Trickshot was formed. Hawkeye then tried to join the Avengers, becoming a crime-fighter himself, but was mistaken for a criminal. He didn’t let that get him down though, and eventually became one of their most valuable members. Personality-wise, Clint plays a ‘straight-man’ role among the Avenger’s team of larger than life heroes, though can be hot-headed as well.
Weapons & Equipment
Green Arrow
http://i.imgur.com/2YZHHzQ.jpg
Oliver wields a Custom Bow designed specifically for his own use by Queen Industries. Said bow possesses a bladed edge, making it effective for both close and long-ranged combat, and according to Ollie himself, it’s much tougher to pull than the average bow. Aside from Standard Arrows, Olly has designed a huge array of Trick Arrows to fire all of which have varying uses and effects. A list of them can be found here and here, but we’ll be citing the ones we believe to be most notable, and effective for this fight. Most of said arrows are pretty self-explanatory anyway.
Greek Fire Arrow: Fires a liquid flame that quickly spreads across most terrain.
Tri-Clamp Arrow: Upon impact separates into 3 restrictors to restrain opponents.
Glue Arrow: An arrow with a ball tip containing a highly reactive, fast drying, industrial polymer. It is designed to look like one of the Green Arrow's explosive arrows and is used to subdue larger, stronger adversaries who mistake it for an explosive device which cannot harm them.
Atomic Warhead Arrow: Motherfucker attached a miniaturized nuclear warhead to a freakin’ arrow! It’s as deadly as the name suggests, though its blast radius makes using it without getting the shooter caught in the explosion somewhat difficult, and he only uses it in desperate situations.
Boxing Glove Arrow: While a seemingly silly arrow-type, it does what the name suggests, and can take enemies down non-lethally. Not exactly Oliver’s best trick arrow, but there’s no way DEATH BATTLE won’t mention it.
Beyond that, Green Arrow has been known to use several melee weapons, such as a katana, and several very creatively named vehicles, such as the Arrowboat, Arrowcar, and Arrowplane, but we highly doubt they’ll factor into the fight.
As of New52, Green Arrow possesses Thermal Vision Goggles, a Kevlar Hood, and a Electricity-resistant Suit. Little else is known about the properties of his outfit.
Hawkeye
http://i.imgur.com/BAHqQAh.jpg
Clint wields a Custom-made Bow, a Special Quiver designed to quickly release arrows of Hawkeye’s choosing, and a combat knife. The Custom Bow naturally has many Trick Arrows that can be used as well. Feel free to go here and here if you want to see more of said Trick Arrows, but we’re once again only listing the notable ones.
Adamantium Arrow: An arrow of sharpened adamantium. It typically has an electrical arrowhead, and being adamantium, pierces through the grand majority of common materials.
Vibranium Arrow: An arrow of sharpened vibranium that is extremely effective at absorbing and negating external pressure and energy. Firing it requires additional tethering, but the speed and force it fires with more than makes up for it.
Pym Particles Arrow: Can alter the size of whoever or whatever it comes in contact with to shrink or enlarge opponents.
Localized Nuke Arrow: Creates a small-scale nuclear blast that’s condensed to a radius that’s between 15 and 20 feet.
Hawkeye has used several weapons such as a Katana, Shurikens, and Nunchakus, but it’s unlikely they will be given to him for this fight, as well as Hawkeye’s standard method of travel, the Sky Cycle.
Skills & Abilities
Green Arrow
http://i.imgur.com/nP6rwJp.png
Green Arrow has displayed on many occasions that he is an Expert in Acrobatics, and often uses this skill while evading enemy fire. Of course, Archery is his bread and butter and is the central point of his fighting style and super hero identity. He claims he could shoot 26-29 arrows per minute. In-terms of close-range capability, he is proficient in several forms of hand-to-hand combat including Judo, Kickboxing and Karate. He has shown the ability to take on seven people at once. As mentioned in his origin, he is an expert at Hunting. He is proficient enough in hunting to pursue a cougar without it ever noticing him.
Hawkeye
http://i.imgur.com/8Y9jKhg.jpg
Like his opponent, Hawkeye is a Master Archer. He is capable of firing multiple arrows at a single target in a few seconds, hitting multiple targets in a few quick strokes, and directly hit small targets from the greatest of distances. This, combined with his Expert Marksmanship makes him capable of being extremely accurate in both direct aiming and complicated rebounds and interactions.
Hawkeye’s time with the circus has made him an Expert in Acrobatics. On top of that, he has received training from Captain America in several forms of combat to train for the moments where he doesn’t have a bow. As Ronin, he held his own against several hordes of ninjas. All without a bow and arrow set. Hawkeye is also a highly competent strategist, tactician, and field commander as seen when he lead the West Coast Avengers or the Thunderbolts (even humiliating an early incarnation of the team by avoiding all their attacks).
Weaknesses
Green Arrow
http://i.imgur.com/HxCfr7N.jpg
While Ollie did shape up quite a bit during his time on Starfish Island, he can still be egotistical and hotheaded at times. No really notable weaknesses exist outside of this quirk, save maybe for the occasions when he grabs the wrong arrow. Instances like this, however, are fairly infrequent, can be chalked up to PIS, and sometimes work out for the better on Ollie’s end.
Hawkeye
http://i.imgur.com/8p8gWi4.jpg
Clint had previously suffered from being 80% deaf, and had to rely on either lip reading, sign language, or a hearing aid in order to hear those around him. He’s typically very level-headed, but like Green Arrow, has his moments of brashness. Recently his hearing was restored, so whether DEATH BATTLE will factor it into the fight is unknown.
Feats
Strength & Destructive Power
Green Arrow
-Does some good old fashion crocodile wrestling.
-Delivers a beatdown to a beefed up metahuman.
-Most destructive arrow creates a blast comparable to a small nuclear warhead.
-Holds his 103 lb (draw strength) bow unmoving for half an hour after giving blood.
Hawkeye
-Pushes a 2-ton car off of himself.
-Delivers a beatdown to several guards in an enclosed elevator.
-Most destructive arrows either create a condensed nuclear blast, or pierce through most common metals.
-Headbutts Venom after he takes a bite out of Clint while tied up, then elbows him back to alter Bullseye’s shot.
-Crossfire couldn’t even muster the strength to pull back on Hawkeye’s 250 lb bow.
Speed, Agility, & Accuracy
Green Arrow
-Shoots off a crime-member’s ponytail while backflipping upside down.
-Shoots 2 arrows down 2 barrels.
-Dodges automatic fire and proceeds to disarm the gunman with 5 arrows while in midair.
-Hits the safety switch to a gun.
-Shoots off Grifter’s mask without harming him, while on a moving vehicle.
-Can shoot arrows through drops of water as they drip out of a tap.
Hawkeye
-Managed to hit Taskmaster (the guy with superhuman reflexes, who can mimic anybody’s movements flawlessly) while in the middle of a motorcycle chase.
-Shoots down 5 targets in 1 go.
-Shoots 2 arrows down the barrel of a double-barreled shotgun from atop a small hill, while the user of said shotgun drives away on a snowmobile.
-Shoots 4 arrows out of the sky with 4 other arrows.
-Bullseyes multiple targets while being rapidly spun around on a training device.
-Dodges out of the way of mini-gun fire.
Conclusion
http://i.imgur.com/bFCYF7g.jpg?1
In case this hasn’t been said enough, this fight is VERY close. The grand majority of advantages that could be argued for one character or the other are either debatable or negligible. As such, we’re going to go straight to the verdicts to give our thoughts.
Verdicts
AkumaTh
This is an incredibly close match. For every advantage one may have, the other is capable of doing something similar. Green Arrow shooting fast? So does Hawkeye. Hawkeye trained by Capt. America in fighting? Green Arrow by the teacher of Deathstroke’s teacher. One of them have a Nuke Arrow? The other one has one as well. One catching an arrow and using said arrow to hit a target? So can the other. You name it, they both got it. This fight is so close, you can flip a coin and can possibly pick the winner. The only slight advantage one has over the other is the ability to hear and under the right circumstances that can prove to be a disadvantage.
This match maybe the only match where Luck may actually be a determining factor. And with Hawkeye’s record from the Additional Links and even the preview we saw so far, that maybe the key to Green Arrow’s victory. Or maybe defeat since Hawkeye manages to get out of these unlucky situations. See what I mean? My official verdict is that, somehow, this ends up being a tie. But for rooting, I’m going to go with Green Arrow because DC can use a win under their belt.
LousyTactician
Everyone's probably tired of hearing this, but this fight is REALLY fucking close! I genuinely don't think anybody can get justifiably butt-hurt over either particular character losing. I'm not saying this in some pansy-ass attempt to quell any possible rage because for once there hasn’t been any. I genuinely think it's the closest fight the show has ever done.
If there’s one part of this debate that I think ended up being directionless it would be the arguments regarding which of the 2 is the better archer. Determining which character is more skilled usually can be of some use in these kind of debates, but I'm of the opinion that this won't lead anywhere for Green Arrow VS. Hawkeye. Both characters have fairly ridiculous archery feats, and any skill or accuracy advantage that could be given to one is really negligible in my oh so humble opinion. Hawkeye's deafness could come into play and be his undoing, but considering it will only factor into stealth, that Clint's recently been 'cured' of it, and that he can always just use a freaking hearing aid, I somehow doubt this will impact the fight.
In order to conclude anything definitive I think the best thing to do is figure out what one opponent has that the other lacks or can't match. On that end, I see Hawkeye's Vibranium, Adamantium, and Pym Particle Arrows as his ace. The first 2 are just straight-up broken, as are most things involving Vibranium and Adamantium. While one of said arrows requires special tethering, they should shoot faster and pierce harder than anything Oliver has in a straight match of arrow to arrow. The Pym Particles meanwhile could easily alter the size of Hawkeye's opponent, which would... Be a really weird way to end the fight, but whatevs.
Granted, Green Arrow does have several arrows I don't think Hawkeye has an answer to. However, I don't think any of them give him the same advantage as these 3 arrows, though not for reason some people have argued.
One of the common arguments against the effectiveness of Green Arrow's Atomic Warhead Arrow is that Hawkeye’s Vibranium arrow and its energy absorbing properties could counteract it. While an interesting idea, and something that would be cool to see in the animation, I think the practicality of this scenario occurring in an actual fight between Oliver and Clint is problematic. I have no doubt Hawkeye would want to use the Vibranium Arrow to intercept the Atomic Warhead Arrow, but doing so would require pre-existing knowledge of the Warhead Arrow’s capabilities. And while said arrow looks quite odd alongside the rest of Oliver’s arsenal, I don’t think that alone would be enough for Clint to immediately think, “Hmm, that arrow is likely a goddamn nuke. Best go for the Vibranium Arrow to intercept that”.
Does this change the possibility of Clint’s victory? Nope. I still have to go with Hawkeye as the victor. For one, Hawkeye has a similar arrow to the Atomic Warhead Arrow, only better because from what I've seen the blast is more localized and the arrow looks much more akin to a normal arrow. This means not only would Hawkeye be more likely to whip out the big guns more quickly and from a closer range, but Green Arrow would be less likely to know about the Localized Nuke Arrow's capability and blast-radius before it's too late.
Again, that’s not to say the fight isn’t close. Both characters counter each other in most categories, and if I had to choose between who is the better archer, I honestly might have to go with Green Arrow. However, between their fairly negligible stats and what I see as a more impressive arsenal on Hawkeye's end, I see the arsenal advantage as a much bigger game-changer.
So yeah, I'm siding with Purple Avenger, but by no means would I consider a victory from the Emerald Archer unjustified.
Ultraguy
To be honest I’m surprised at the support hawkey is getting despite this match being so “close”. Anyway I’m gonna keep this short. I think Hawkeye has a slight advantage in strength, training and adaptability. When the arrows run out, he can improvise other projectiles. He trained more consistently from youth and he’s a bit larger than Green arrow. It’s not much, but it’s enough to slide the the match in his favor.
Also Hawkeye has a wife and several kids. I sure as hell don’t want to see them become orphans.
Guest verdicts
Hey guys for the first time we’ve decided to start adding “guest verdicts” from our G1 community into our blogs. We hope you enjoy hearing the insightful opinions of your peers.
Comicking428
(Use this for my Profile Pic https://yt3.ggpht.com/-MXKdS4Xg9D0/AAAAAAAAAAI/AAAAAAAAAAA/Zab5P3o-2qo/s900-c-k-no/photo.jpg)
Green Arrow and Hawkeye are characters that rank among the top in my favorites for Marvel and DC, even where I’ve cosplayed as Hawkeye recently. As the others will tell you, this match is a little too close to tell as one has the counters to the other. Green Arrow may have more trick arrows on the wikipedia page, but Hawkeye’s literally had a few pages in a Marvel Encyclopedia that shows over a hundred of his trick arrows (and that was a few years ago, he’s bound to have more now). Both are some of the best martial artists in their respective universes and have fought the best but are ultimately held back by either their humanity, or the fact that their universe has people like Batman and Iron Fist in them.
In a matchup like this what’s important is to examine possible quantities and qualities of them to separate differences, and even those differences are too difficult to judge. I honestly wouldn’t mind if there was a tie between the two. Most of the ties that have happened on Death Battle were for joke based episodes, but I don’t think even the most serious of debaters would have an issue with this matchup being a tie.
However, there’s a good chance that it will not happen, so I should choose who I think should be the winner. Hawkeye, but just barely.
Obviously it’s a bit difficult to measure skill, but in terms of experience, generally Hawkeye’s started his training in both archery and fighting at a younger age. Hawkeye perfected his archery when he was a kid in the circus. While Green Arrow started when he was a kid, he began to truly master it when he was stranded on the island as a young adult, since he took a little break in his drunken playboy state. I don’t think we can argue who’s the better archer overall given their insane accuracy skills. But this isn’t the main or only factor of the fight.
Hawkeye’s training with Captain America started when he joined the Avengers which was very early in his superhero career, while Green Arrow’s biggest training with experts like Natas came much more later, giving Clint a little more time to perfect his style. Clint even beat Cap once in Blind Spot, though similar with Oliver’s fight with Red Hood, it’s something not guaranteed to happen all the time.
I also find Hawkeye to be a bit more adaptable than Green Arrow in general. Yes I know GA’s origin story is all about adaptability, but one of the things Hawkeye’s known for the most is taking anything he finds and making it a weapon. Whether it’s cards, a coin, or a freakin hairpin, he can accurately shoot projectiles with and without a bow (I’m not gonna include Ultimate Hawkeye on this one, since he’s insane enough to use his own fingernails as projectiles). During his run as Ronin, Clint also demonstrated proficiency in katanas, nunchucks, shurikens, staffs, etc. He used this wide melee weapon arsenal and still retained his archery and accuracy skills. Clint’s been regarded as one of the best in the Marvel Universe for martial arts by experts like Cap and Iron Fist.
Plus he’s good at playing games and tricks on foes, so much so that he saved the universe with an old parlor trick.
Some think that Clint’s deafness may be a major factor in this fight, but I say it just adds to his adaptability skills. The guy’s fought deaf but still has great skills and reflexes and even defeated his brother Trickshot (basically Hawkeye’s Merlyn) while blind in Blindspot. Think he can’t catch an arrow blind? He says otherwise. The writers practically forgot Hawkeye was deaf for a while, and Franklin Richards brought Hawkeye back from the dead without his deafness because that’s how he remembered him. You could say he either hid it really well, or it really didn’t impact him that much, and I’m willing to bet the authors will hardly take note of this in the far future similar to how they’ve handled his deafness in the past. Besides, he has hearing aids and he does have a sonic arrow to give GA a similar feeling.
Some people think that Green Arrow’s battles with other archers like Merlyn and Komodo will benefit on the experience side, but Hawkeye’s had plenty of run ins with master archers like the two Trickshots (One’s his teacher the other’s his bro), Taskmaster (Who’s only a master archer because he copied Clint), and even once took on an army of 100 archer guards while retrieving an ancient treasure. It wasn’t a fair fight, for the guards.
Of course I’m not ignorant to what Ollie’s capable of and who he’s fought, but I think Hawkeye’s edge in experience and adaptability are enough to barely give him the win. Looking at it now he might have the edge in strength as well with feats such as the car lifting feat or his heavy bow.
For those who want Green Arrow to win purely because Marvel’s got more wins on the show, chances are this isn’t the last Marvel vs DC matchup that’ll happen on Death Battle, and there’s plenty of popular matchups requested that has the DC character win (Flash vs Quicksilver anyone?). Plus, if it hasn’t been clear already, it’s a bit tough to choose a winner here.
Special thanks to the ODBFB for letting me share my opinions. To end my overly long verdict, a rhyme:
Personally, I’d like a tie,
But as it stands, I’m team Hawkeye
metabro
(you know what to use for my avi)
First off, thanks for including me guys!
I've made my case pretty clear in the forums, so I'm just going to repeat what I said there
"This fight is notoriously close, as it has been repeated ad nauseam in the thread. Any feat of archery you might bring up for one character, the other has a feat that matches. Any trick arrow one has that can win in one blow can be countered by one from the other. It's been mentioned that strength-wise Hawkeye has the edge, but it's not to such a level that Ollie can't compete with (he's fought superhumans physically and either won or held his own). Green Arrow has a stealth advantage that could potentially capitalize on Clint's hearing weakness (which is explored in greater detail in his recent series), but you can argue that he has enough experience against other stealthy characters to help mitigate that. Speed, reactions, agility, rate of fire, durability, and endurance are all relatively even too
You can't really argue that one has more experience than the other either. While it's true Hawkeye had more training from an earlier age compared to Post-Crisis Green Arrow, we see Green Arrow has been training from a young age similar to Hawkeye in New 52. You can argue that Clint's formal training with the bow matches Ollie's self-taught and innate skill. In addition, both characters have had tons of experience against similar opponents, from street level criminals to cosmic threats
Hawkeye is the better martial artist if we're counting just Post-Crisis, given his ability to turn seemingly anything into a weapon, but Post-Crisis Green Arrow is a very respectable martial artist in his own right, especially after Natas' training, and can hold his own until he can clear some space. Counting New 52, however, Hawkeye's advantage becomes a slight one at best, which adding Injustice's bladed bow into the mix, as well as the fact that the Arrow family and Green Arrow rogues gallery are composed of some of the top martial artists in DC, the martial arts angle becomes less of a deciding factor than what some people might believe it to be, though a prolonged or pure melee battle is still likely in Hawkeye's favor
So because this episode is not likely going to win in a tie, one factor rises above all the others: tactics. Can Hawkeye put the pressure on Green Arrow and make him run out of arrows, forcing a H2H fight where he can eventually win with his higher strength and fighting skill? Can Green Arrow play his cards right and escape from sight with a trick arrow, then exploit Hawkeye's weakness and one shot him with one of his more handy arrows? Can either of them realize what the other is doing and make adjustments based on their current situations? This is probably the biggest deciding factor for people when choosing between these archers
Hawkeye has led a number of superhero teams and has even received pointers from Captain America himself in tactical ability. Adding the unpredictable nature of his fighting style due to pulling everyday objects around him and mixing them with his fighting style, many people argue he has the advantage here. But it is also true that Clint can be very brash, bold, and a needless risk taker. Sometimes he jumps the gun and goes into a fight without thinking, even though he has had training to not do so, and he has been known to let his temper get the better of him on at least a few occasions
Green Arrow might have only led the Arrow family, but his ability to think on his feet and surprise opponents with his ingenuity shouldn't be understated. He's fought alongside and gone up against enough highly skilled martial artists that Hawkeye might not bring anything new to the table other than a much wider arsenal of trick arrows. And when it comes to experience fighting against fellow master bowmen, Ollie's rogues gallery is just more impressive and he has had to deal with them on a much more regular basis. Ollie's expansive list of villains, both human and superpowered, that he has to deal on top of the Justice League villains he's tasked with fighting from time to time is explored more often than Clint's, which could be a big deciding factor in the experience category. He does possess similar flaws, however, as he can be just as stubborn, short tempered, and rash as Clint at times. However, even noted tacticians like Deathstroke and Red Hood were amazed by how skilled he became after training with Natas, and though New 52 granted him a team to keep him updated with his missions, his ability to come up with clever strategies and surprise much more powerful enemies through skill and tactical knowledge is still very impressive
You can argue either one of these guys is the winner and you will not be wrong. They are just too close to call. However, it comes down to who is better able to adapt, surprise, and outthink the other. If you ask me, being able to outsmart and keep up with Deathstroke is the most impressive feat of the two, and Green Arrow regularly deals with a more expansive rogues gallery than Hawkeye, so I say Green Arrow takes it by a hair on his mustache"
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