Monday, January 15, 2024

Prediction Blog: Kasen Ibaraki vs Fleetway Sonic

 I made this as part of my Patreon. Feel free to join it to vote on characters and blogs I’ll do in the future. The next prediction blog will be Meta Knight vs Zero.

Also I wanna encourage everyone to read another blog on this match made by a friend of mine named Kirbonic. I would argue his version is more thorough than my own! He did a great job so leave him a comment.

Background

Kasen


The main protagonist of the Horned Hermit side story. Kasen is one of many youkai(essentially spirits) living in the area of Gensokyo. Gensokyo being a special location residing behind a dimensional barrier where spirits that depend on the spiritual belief of mankind live. Kasen spends most of her series getting to know Touhou main character Reimu, a girl tasked with protecting Gensokyo and Hakurei shrine from malevolent youkai that could disrupt balance of the location. She’s also introduced as a “hermit”, a person who’s gained enhanced spiritual strength through religious training.


Eventually it is revealed that Kasen was once an evil Oni spirit, and was a member of the “four devas”. In her past she was defeated in battle and the evil within her was essentially sliced off of her in the form of a severed arm. Kasen then chose to essentially reformed herself.


Over the course of her story the seal on this arm weakened, causing it to manifest as an evil version of Kasen and eventually fuse with her. However by manipulating events in her favor Kasen is able to get series protagonist Reimu to excise the evil in the form of her severed arm once again. 


Kasen continues to be friends with Reimu and the main cast afterwards. 

Sonic

Sonic’s background in Fleetway is somewhat different compared to most Sonic continuities. In this universe he was originally a normal brown haired hedgehog, and only gained his blue spikes after breaking the sound barrier. Sonic green eyes were also the result of exposure to energy from the monster chaos.


Sonic and Robotnik were also originally friends in this continuity. Robotnik initially went by the name “Kintobar” and worked with Sonic to try remove evil from the planet with an experiment using the chaos emeralds. It was a freak accident with Kintobar’s evil computer system and the contamination from a rotten egg that caused Kintobar to become the evil Robotnik. Ironically it’s later shown Sonic himself sabotaged the machine via time travel hijinks.


In the final story of the Fleetway Continuity Sonic and Co are able to reverse this transformation turning Robotnik back into the good Kintobar.


Game continuity

It’s implied or stated that “most” classic Sonic games happened in the Fleetway Sonic continuity.


Abilities

Kasen


Magic

Magical spiritual energy that can be used to fuel various forms of attack or phenomenon. Some of the more notable applications of magic is to directly attack the soul or spirit of others, as well as altering fortune (probability) in your favor. Control over fortune can also prevent interference of other aspects of magic from working.


Spell cards/Danmaku

Spell cards are “designated” names for magical attacks, moves and abilities used in the Touhou universe. In gameplay of the series these are typically utilized to form the energy “bullet patterns” of energy spheres and attacks, aka Danmaku. In older titles these skills were activated using actual “cards”, but that concept has since been dropped. 


Spell cards exist in the universe as part of a “duel” system that series protag Rimiru created to settle disputes. Both sides of a conflict typically agree to what spell cards can be utilized during a given fight, and victory is typically awarded based on who has the most visually stunning performance or visual aesthetic of their attack rather than their raw power. As spell cards attacks are intended for formal duels, they “generally” aren't intended to be lethal. Though obviously common sense dictates a user could choose to use similar attacks in a lethal way if they want. 


Notable spell cards:


Urban legend power

During the Urban Legend crises Kasen was able to tap into the power of the spiritual power attached to the human belief in the  The Monkey's Paw urban legend. This allowed her to create large hands to ensnare or entrap people. This power is ”Possibly” exclusive to the circumstances of the Urban legend fighting game.


Spiritual/incorporeal existence

Youkai are primarily spiritual beings. They can create physical bodies for themselves, but are capable of surviving without them or even reducing their bodies to incorporal mists at will.

 

Space/time manipulation

Kasen can manipulate space/time. Such as creating pocket dimensions via a technique called Senkai. Sensing rifts in space, sending people to alternate dimensions and even tearing holes in space/time barriers.


Energy manipulation

Kasen can fire various types of magic energy projectiles.


Longevity/Immortality

Youkai by default have extremely long lifespans, and hermits are described as being immortal or removed from the cycle of reincarnation. Kasen specially has been shown to be at least 1000s of years old.


Flight

Kasen can fly.


Regeneration

Youkai are capable of regenerating lethal wounds and even their entire bodies. Kasen herself does this after her Oni form is destroyed by Reimu. 


Misc


Sonic


Spin Dash/Dash Attack

A dashing spin attack. Sonic can use it to cut through objects.


Instant Shield

By vibrating the molecules in front of him Sonic can create a shield of air to block attacks.


Misc


Arsenal

Kasen


Artificial arm

An artificial arm used to replace Kasen’s severed arm.  It can move independently of Kasen herself and form bandages into various weapons or wraps for attacking foes.


Animal allies

Kasen is well known for her animal handling skills and can even speak to animals directly. She has numerous pets and animal allies that can help her fight in battles.


Koutei

A dragon that Kasen can use to alter the weather or attack foes with electricity. 


Mokuo/Ruiji

A rat-like animal that can poison foes, cause thunderstorms and shock opponents.


Kume

A pet eagle that Kasen can ride on or command to attack foes.


Housu

An attack Tiger.


Manzairuku

A pet seal that can attack foes with a beach ball.


Ibaraki Box of Medicine/Sake

A medicine box filled with sake that has great healing properties. Drinking too much of it can turn normal people into an Oni. Kasen uses it to keep her artificial arm from rotting away.



 Sonic


Power sneakers

Sonic sneakers. They’re designed to be anti-friction.


Power rings

Rings that can be absorbed as a source of extra energy.


Kintobor AI

An AI program based on the original mind of Dr.Kintobor. Sonic can communicate with it during missions.


Functions

The Kintobar AI can perform various supportive functions. Including hacking into machines, tracking energy signals, and surveying the planet's environment.


Chaos emeralds

The Fleetway rendition of the chaos emeralds. They can absorb evil energy and empower beings with infinite chaos power. In some comics scans they’re stated to make people 1000 times stronger.


Over the course of the series they take on various “forms”. Initially being split into separate physical forms and depowered. By the end of Fleetway there’s seven total and they take on a diamond cut shape similar to the games.


In Fleetway it’s the gray chaos emerald that acts as the “Master Emerald” and can control the powers of all the others.


Chaos energy can be utilized for various reality warping and space/time alteration purposes. Such as…..


Transmutation/matter manipulation


Time travel


Size alteration


Teleportation


Reality warping


Timeline alteration


Power nullification


Regeneration


Memory alteration


Energy absorption


Transformations

Kasen


Ibaraki-Douji

A partially manifested form of Kasen’s original oni form, created by the severed arm that contained all of her original evil energy and personality. At the end of her manga it was capable of manifesting its own body and fighting Reimu head on. This version of Kasen displayed powers of necromancy and also had a “non-existent” form that was implied to be invisible to most.


Deva Kasen

Kasen’s original form. It was recreated by having her fuse back together with her severed arm. The form is Kasens most powerful state and even had resistance to sealing.


Sonic


Super Sonic

A corrupted “superform” caused by Sonic’s exposure to the evil tainted chaos energy at the start of his series. Unlike most series Fleetway Super Sonic is an aggressive alter ego, who is much more aggressive and destructive than the normal Sonic. 


Additionally Sonic does NOT need chaos emeralds on hand to become Super Sonic. While the form can be forcibly activated in the presence of chaos or ring energy, Sonic can transform at any time when undergoing enough physical or mental stress. In these cases the form will just run off any latent ring/chaos energy Sonic has in his body.


Transforming via chaos/Ring energy


Transforming via stress


Flight

Super Sonic has the ability to fly


Energy projection

Super Sonic con projects energy from his body.


Pyrokinesis

Super Sonic can generate fire.


Energy shield

Super Sonic can project energy shields around himself.


Laser eyes 

Super Sonic has laser vision


Time stop resistance 

Super Sonic has resistance to time based abilities.


Energy draining 

Super Sonic can drain energy from other sources.


Time limit

Super Sonic does still have a time limit of sorts, though it's less defined than other continuities. Without a constant source of chaos energy Sonic will revert back to his normal form “eventually”. Likewise while Super Sonic was once able to exist as his own separate entity for a time, he was in danger of dying after going for a long period of time without chaos energy. Thus implying he can’t operate at full strength indefinitely.


Hyper Sonic

A new Superform exclusive to Sonic the comic online. After having the evil in Super Sonic and the chaos emeralds purified, Sonic was able to utilize emerald energy in a more positive manner to form Hyper Sonic. This form has all of Super Sonic’s powers, but with the benefit of keeping Sonic himself in control.

  • It's stated that Sonic was evil in his super form because the original chaos energy he was exposed to was contaminated with evil. After being purified and absorbing normal chaos energy sonic becomes hyper sonic http://www.stconline.co.uk/comics/stc275/ 

Feats

Kasen


Strength


Speed


Endurance


Scaling

Kasen has been able to fight on par with series protagonist Reimu. Hence she should very much be able to scale to pretty much anyone in the touhou series, given Reimu is arguably the strongest character in the cast.


Experience


Sonic


Strength


Endurance


Speed

Scaling

General characters


Super level enemies


Experience


General monsters


Named villains


Verdict

I’m probably going to keep things fairly short. In terms of stats it's pretty obvious that base Sonic is weaker than most high end Touhou characters. As far as I’m aware Sonic can’t blow up universes or whatever. I’d also say that “abilities” wise base Sonic doesn’t really have a lot out of the ordinary compared to most other versions of sonic. It’s mainly the spin dash, standard applications of super speed and maybe some tertiary stuff from early games if you want to lean into the idea of them being technically cannon to Fleetway.


The argument is “mainly” between Kasen and Super Sonic or Hyper Sonic.


Anyway in terms of raw power I’ll probably argue both are equal enough in speed. Both can scale to feats of crossing infinite distances or affecting entire spacetimes. In terms of strength I would probably agree with arguments that Touhou seems to have more leeway in terms of cosmology.


In the main comics proper Fleetway Sonic “mostly” just established the main universe and special zone in terms of universe size dimensions. There were a couple of arguments for expanding outside of that, such as the mirror universe, atomic universe, limbo and a few other pocket dimensions, but they typically were less clear cut or elaborated on. You really need to lean into the more obscure novels to find arguments for numerous timelines or full alternate dimensions existing. Touhou (IMO) seems to have much more dimensions in its main cannon, and heaven alone could be calculated to be huge based on the size of Amibtabha and technically is sorta its own multiverse. So I would lean on Kasen taking power giving both side equal levity(there's also DT arguments for both sides, but fuck that lmao).


Abilities wise I think Kasen probably outdoes Super Sonic in terms of abilities she’s actually displayed. Many of the chaos powers that could give Super or Hyper Sonic an advantage are technically powers he never personally showcased. He’s almost been portrayed like a strength based brawler, not a reality warping entity similar to God Robotnik. That said, even granting Super Sonic all chaos powers seen in the series, I think Kasen can probably counter everything that matters.


Transmutation and size alteration: Youkai can alter their form and are not dependent on physical bodies anyway.


Teleportation: Kasen can do this too more or less


Timeline alteration: There’s Touhou characters who can do this, and control over Fortune/probability should help mitigate this.


Memory alteration: Has resistance via true moon resistance


Regeneration: Kasen seemingly also has resistance to this.


I’ll give Sonic one advantage, the time limit in Fleetway is way more “arguable” than most other Sonic series. I don’t think you could just outlast his super form as easily, and you could argue that Super Sonic could run indefinitely depending on the circumstances. But even if Super Sonic was as strong as Kasen I don’t think he’d be insurmountable. Super Sonic has been removed from Sonic before, Super Sonic has been imprisoned/sealed before. Both of which feels like Kasen could do given her ability to remove souls or her sending Remi to Avci.


Kasen ultimately seems to have the most advantages, so I’m gonna side in her favor.
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3 comments:

  1. DarrylJanuary 15, 2024 at 10:37 PM

    You have been putting in work GOAT

    ReplyDelete
  2. CoolJanuary 24, 2024 at 8:43 AM

    Meta Knight Vs Zero? Oh yeah baby!

    ReplyDelete
  3. Disco2512December 4, 2024 at 5:38 AM

    With all due respect I totally disagree, most of Sonic's skills and abilities were not shown, the same thing for the feats, with the countless debunks of Touhou the verse doesn't even catch on universal, Kasen for example is Mountain Level, and the infinite speed was proven false, while Sonic has immeasurable speed

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